Of course, I would not accept it. No one on Rolia suggested that! I would use all possible legal ways that are permitted in Canada to defend myself and my family. No reasonable parents would do nothing and just sit tight. -hkchan(0) @BC省华人论坛:BC省枫下论坛 The Rolia Forum of BC

枫下茶话 / 社会 / loveblue有精神病的假设，以及虐待孩子的猜测，都已推翻。我们暂且不考虑这里面究竟谁的错, 那么换位思考：如果你是loveblue, 你觉得自己冤不冤？ -goldensands(Dream); 2009-7-7 {230} (#5398402@0)
带自己孩子看病，病没看成，孩子反被收走啦。

接回来的条件就是必须承认自己有精神病 (或者是虐待行为)。

想出外躲躲，结果还被强制送到精神病院治疗...

我们暂且不考虑这里面究竟谁的错，就只问各位一句，如果换作你，你觉得自己冤不冤？

Why don't you go and sign up for bill93 -james4rn(james); 2009-7-7 (#5398409@0)

本来还想去签名的，但是从LOVEBLUE事件让我看到了所谓被迫害的家庭真相到底是什么，支持CAS 的工作!!! -may11(May); 2009-7-7 (#5398514@0)
改变法律只是改进不良现象的手段之一。最重要的还是要抓住眼前的事例，让cas解释其行为，把cas 的责任查清楚如果没有个案的支撑和其他方式的民意表达，bill93那只不过是空中楼阁，镜花水月，最终陷入无休止的争论或胎死腹中。 -buug(Crouching Tiger); 2009-7-7 {146} (#5400234@0)
比如说，RCMP滥用TASER已讨论多年，但是规则越改越没有约束力。试想如果没有Dziekanski 一案，没有公众对该案的关心，人们能期望单通过立法程序改变现状吗？

So the doctor/nurse who reported the problem was wrong, the CAS worker was wrong, whoever called Britisih police was wrong, the British police officer was wrong, the British psycharist was wrong. And you are right! -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {681} (#5398539@0)
Did CAS worker seize the baby because the victim took her baby to so many doctor or her emotional behaviour. Did you have the CAS report from her husband?

Her own words "想想我在这些医生面前的表现也是非常的情绪化"

"接回来的条件就是必须承认自己有精神病 (或者是虐待行为)。" where did you learn this?

"结果还被强制送到精神病院治疗..." Who called the British police? Ontario CAS? Do you think Ontario CAS has authority to instruct a British mental hospital and its professional psycharist to admit a patient if she was OK. And do you think Ontario CAS has such power to instuct foreign police officer and mental hospital even when the victm was completely normal?

签保证书，还有好多条件限制，比如不能和孩子单独待在一起，这些难道不是被迫承认自己有错吗？！ -goldensands(Dream); 2009-7-7 (#5399250@0)

还有好多条件限制. apart from 不能和孩子单独待在一起, what other conditions do you know? This 条件 does not mean she 有错; just mean she MAY put her baby in danger. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399360@0)

你口口声声要我proof CAS的果实，我来问你CAS认定she MAY put her baby in danger.的proof在哪里？我看你那么偏执狂热， you MUST put your kids in danger。梅妖赶紧报告CAS吧。 -oldyou(CAS是狼外婆吗); 2009-7-7 (#5399389@0)

I don't have the proof and I didn't say "she MAY put her baby in danger". I just tried to tell Dream the CAS condition only meant "she MAY put her baby in danger". CAS put this condition into the agreement so you have to ask CAS for the proof. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399414@0)

对一个死人，没有proof却说人家 MAY put her baby in danger。这究竟是良心被狗吃了，还是脑子真的坏了？ -oldyou(CAS是狼外婆吗); 2009-7-7 (#5399437@0)

Please don't put words into my mouth and read my post carefully. I didn't say "she MAY put her baby in danger". I just tried to help Drean to understand the CAS condition and interpret what the condition really meant. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399448@0)

如果说梅妖是绑匪，你就是尸体解剖官。CAS有你们这样的粗大神经，不强大都难。 -oldyou(CAS是狼外婆吗); 2009-7-7 (#5399460@0)

Does Rolia allow a Rolian to insult another Rolian? 良心被狗吃了, 绑匪. What else you can insult another Rolian? Is this a civilized discussion? Is this how Chinese discuss? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399477@0)

BTW, you don't have any proof to accuse CAS but you do it all time. Then what are you? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399449@0)

CAS要是那个死妈，我也会shut up my mouth。懂了吗 -oldyou(CAS是狼外婆吗); 2009-7-7 (#5399498@0)

"良心被狗吃了', this is a personal insult and I have to warn you to stop! -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399455@0)

OOPS，打起来了～～ -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399503@0)

唉～～你还是不改看热闹的毛病 -oldyou(CAS是狼外婆吗); 2009-7-7 (#5399513@0)

西西，这个不算身体毛病，算精神上的。油，HKCHAN，你们说我们现在是不是该去看医生呀？ -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399526@0)

A good sleep would do! Can't sleep well when the child is sick. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399539@0)

这回证明了你看中文，基本靠猜。你咋看的金庸小说呀？ -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399546@0)

感情他看不懂我的中文，我看懂他的英文了吗 -oldyou(CAS是狼外婆吗); 2009-7-7 (#5399569@0)

good that you can understand my poor English! I don't mind you disagree with my idea / opinion but please don't attack personally during our discussion. I appreciate your argument but feel offensive when you said I was 良心被狗吃了' -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399601@0)

You are right and guess what my favoriate 金庸 character is. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399592@0)

恭喜你，总算有了那个妈妈４年前的感觉 -oldyou(CAS是狼外婆吗); 2009-7-7 (#5399551@0)

You may not believe me and I can't give you the proof. One of my volunteer works that I do requires me to take care a austim boy for 1.5 hour a week. This is the longest 1.5 hour I have. I am not a cold blood as you think. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {375} (#5399591@0)
This is why I think the mother had depression. I only do it for 1.5 hour so that his parents can take a break, I can't imagine I can survive without any help for 4 years.

And this is why I want people to focus on mental health awareness instead of CAS (until we have futher proof). You don't know how many hidden time bombs that would destroy another family around us.

It is not legal to 打 in Canada but there are other legal ways to protect your reputation in Canada. You can find out more from the Legel Referral Services. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399516@0)

这娃儿中文欠点。 -copperbean(豆泡果之铜豌豆); 2009-7-7 (#5399532@0)

Not just 欠点! Mine is actually terrible! -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399537@0)

I know you're learning and already got a great progress. -copperbean(豆泡果之铜豌豆); 2009-7-7 (#5399541@0)

still miles away! -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399596@0)

你和一个不长脑子的人争什么争啊，你没看到这个人没有思维能力吗？ -newmajia2(新马甲2); 2009-7-7 (#5400694@0)

Please don't be personal! -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399421@0)

这事只有她老公才知道一些真相，旁人在这里都是谣传加谣传，瞎猜加瞎猜。当事人都不吭声，不相干的人在这里上窜下跳，反对也好支持也好，都是扯蛋。 -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398545@0)

This is why I keep asking them the question to confirm their source of information. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398554@0)
有些人一贯在网上胡说八道，他们生生把人家害死了，如果不找出CAS的毛病，他们良心何安啊？可怜可怜他们吧 -vega_lee(天津包子-就不改); 2009-7-7 (#5398555@0)

同意！！！ -may11(May); 2009-7-7 (#5398559@0)
Exactly. -wincity(toad); 2009-7-7 (#5398572@0)
But first someone has to prove that CAS was wrong first. Can any Rolian do it ? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398583@0)
What's the evidence that those people killed loveblue through the Internet? Laughing at your 天津包子 brain. -fairness(直言执言); 2009-7-7 (#5398610@0)

There is no evidence excpet the victim said "昨天那篇CAS每年死80个孩子的贴子导致了我精神崩毁" but she didn't say she would commit suicide because of the psot. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398642@0)

Who said "接回来的条件就是必须承认自己有精神病"王先生签署了保证书"，the newspaper only said "同意不会让妻子单独照顾孩子" -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398550@0)

You waste your time here trying to convince other people. Not everyone can adapt to new culture. That's why we have self-contained Chinese community, Indian community here. Let the time take its course, next generation will be better off. -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398570@0)

Not everyone can adapt to new culture. This is the key. I'm just trying my best to do something for those who cannot, like the died mother in this case. -oldyou(); 2009-7-7 (#5398575@0)

油兄，你的表现很象愤青。hkcan是个玩家。要是你们两对赌的话，我一定压宝在他身上，赌你一定会输。 -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398588@0)

谢谢你提醒，他这个玩家，让我好好地见识了加拿大的五毛党。 -oldyou(); 2009-7-7 (#5398591@0)

Using your argument, are you 五毛党 against CAS as well? LOL! What did you achieve so far? Did CAS even hear your noise on Rolia? Did you add any value to victim's family? Did you bring the justice to her family? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398603@0)

what is 玩家 meant? I don't need to win or lose. The victim and her family lost everything they have for ever. And I hope this would never happen again in our community, but people are losing their focus. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {168} (#5398599@0)
Accusing CAS on Rolia would not change anything now or future; instead we should be focus on mental health awareness and how to handle CAS if we encounter it in future.

Nothing offence. Just mean you know the rules of engagement, you know how to play within this society, you know the common practice here, you have the ability to do critical thinking. -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398613@0)

The I hope everyone is 玩家. We now live in Canada and we have to do thing according to Canadian rules and regulations. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398646@0)

Come on. If everyone is as good as you are, how can you make better living. Just for reality check, certain percentage population have to stay at the bottom of the society due to different reasons. Not every dream will come true. -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398684@0)

You are right, I guess I am too much an idealist. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398690@0)
What are the intended messages you tried to deliver? It sounds annoying to me anyway. -whynot108(s2w); 2009-7-7 (#5399011@0)

i was an idealist as hkcan and believed that we could change the world if we try hard enough. but not any more. i'm sorry if my words annoyed you. just try to persuade hkcan to give up his fruitless effort here. i know i should shut up. -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5399169@0)

I hope you can stay and don't give up. Do you know about 50 years ago, black students could not enter university in US and now Obama is the US president. And men in HK could have more than 1 wife and how many HK women are in senior positions at HK? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399183@0)

if you want to change your career some day, i will vote for you. i can see you have a dream, hope your dream will come true. i forgot my dream long time ago. it's time for me to shut up. -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5399216@0)

Sorry to disappoint you but I am just a poor Chinese and have a family to raise. I don't mind to volunteer couple nights a week to help people. But I don't think I can do it full time. Social workers do not earn a lot. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {92} (#5399232@0)
You can't build Roman in days and if you give up, you would never see your dream come true.

Oldyou, I understad you do it for a good course; however, is that the right direction? You can keep accusing CAS on Rolia for ever and what good that can do for our Chinese community? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398592@0)

For those who can not adapt to new culture, what ultimate price they will have to pay? -oldyou(); 2009-7-7 (#5398576@0)

Most of time, nothing will happen. They live in their own community and feel comfortable about the culture and people around them. When there is a clash, they will pay high price, just like the owner of grocery store. -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398582@0)

That poor owner probably do what every owner of grocery store in China would do when they catch a thief; except he forgot he is in Canada. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398585@0)
成白上千印第安儿童的生命，换来了百年后加拿大人对于白人文化至上思维的反思。今天一位中国人母亲crash死l了，可叹国人有说，你适应得不够好。可怜可怜 -oldyou(); 2009-7-7 (#5398590@0)

我们也觉得自己的文化至上，不是吗？万国来朝，五夷臣服，少数民族落后野蛮，鬼佬阿差ＸＸＸ，是不是天天耳闻目睹？ -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398604@0)

所以也应该有个叫兽出来说，你crash而死，谁叫你不幸移来加国。 -oldyou(); 2009-7-7 (#5398668@0)

有空去读些研究文章，有关于葡萄牙印度中国移民研究的，实际问题都大同小异。没有人愿意看到悲剧发生，可悲剧每天都在发生，和新环境正面对立冲撞，只能是更多的悲剧。入乡随俗，祖上的真知灼见啊。 -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398731@0)

do you have the link, I am interested to read these documents as well. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398801@0)

I don't. I've read a couple of books and thesis from a library in U of T. They've done quite good researches. It takes time for those researches to have impact on government policies. -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398821@0)

if you recall the name of those book, please PM me. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398834@0)

if she was still in China and she had her family to help her take care her children; especially her edler one and she was not stress out. Yeah, I know, too much ifs, would she still be living now? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {456} (#5398773@0)
I don't know every immigrant families, but most immigrant families I know are extremely busy. One has to go to work at 7 am so that he can leave office and go to school to pick up the kids by 3 pm and the other one has to drop the kids to school in morning and won't be back to office by 10 am. They are very stress out and just imagine you have a child who is autism. Do you know any family which has children who are autism or even less serious ADD?

A mother lost her life! You can easily point finger to CAS without providing any evidence and ignore the fact that there may other reasons behind her death. Until we have all the pieces of this puzzle and put them together, -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {129} (#5398614@0)
we don't know the whole truth. You can keep speculate and accuse CAS but you may want to ask yourself what you achieved so far.
这个比得不恰当。印第安人是被夺，移民是要，这能一样吗？移民只能在别人已经制定好的框架下争取自己最大的权益。还从文化的优劣上来比较，有意思吗？文化无优劣，只有主导和从属。 -copperbean(豆泡果之铜豌豆); 2009-7-7 {54} (#5398631@0)
而且个人不认同这完全是个文化差异的问题，你在混淆视听。

And you can also change the system if you want. Come out to be elected in the next election. If there are 10% Chinese MPP, you voice (not noise) can be heard. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398650@0)

Obama is white but his skin. If Obama is real black, i guess US will have a different leader. If a Chines gets elected as MP, he definitely doesn't represent the Chinese at the bottom but for elite only. -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398781@0)

How about 黃志華? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398928@0)

He's definitely an elite if you check his career path. I respect his dedication and contribution. Did he represent my interest? No. Would I vote for him if he did not die? No. -lovenature(BlackBear); 2009-7-7 (#5398959@0)

You may be right that I am wasting my time but all I wish to do is other people would not believe those myth, rumor and partial facts which may cause another disaster. And I hope Rolia can arrange regular seminar on mental awareness -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398587@0)

那还要怎么做？你现在一定自认为很正常吧，也没作什么威胁孩子安全的事情吧，如果现在某组织过来也要求你以后不可以单独和孩子在一起拉，你认为你能接受吗？如果你能接受，认为这是加国文化，我无话可说。 -goldensands(Dream); 2009-7-7 (#5399272@0)

Of course, I would not accept it. No one on Rolia suggested that! I would use all possible legal ways that are permitted in Canada to defend myself and my family. No reasonable parents would do nothing and just sit tight. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {1250} (#5399334@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛But on the other hand, was the victm 很正常 and had no threat to her baby?

That was the question I asked all alone. Before the baby was taken from the mother, was the mother normal and had no theat to her baby? The timing is key! We had to understand the situation before the baby was taken. Whatever the victim said and did after the baby was taken did not matter. As some of you suggested, the mother could be dirven to crazy because CAS took away the baby. So it is not fair to read her post after the incident and said the mother was crazy.

Unfortunately, some of her own words were not quite favor to herself, e.g. "想想我在这些医生面前的表现也是非常的情绪化" and ""我老公和周围的人都说我神经不正常"

I don't know if you are a father / mother or not. But if you see a woman behaves very emotion and your judgement is that the baby would be in danger. What would you do? Would you call 911 first. But the police may take a few minutes to come and if you think the baby is in immediate danger, would you try to save the baby yourself. I would even If I know the mother would sue me later.

What was the situation that drove the CAS worker to decide to take the baby into his cusotday? I don't know! Does anyone know?更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

又是地铁小报：今天有个单亲妈妈，因为没有照顾好孩子，孩子病死了。被以谋杀控告。证据就是她没有赴约带孩子看医生以及没买医生开的药。不过这个是美国的事。不过也能看出，CAS的确也收拾了很多烂人，“保护”了孩子（仅仅是生命吧？）。 -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5398767@0)

So what do you think? If a child was dead just because her mother didn't give the child the right medicine. Remeber the cancer boy story in Ontario, do you think CAS should step in to FORCE the boy to continue his treatment? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5398786@0)

我本来的话题意图就是问问这个同胞的遭遇是不是冤，因为以前有人认为这个不幸的母亲的结局是自找的。结果大家还是跑题拉。 -goldensands(Dream); 2009-7-7 (#5399244@0)

Please don't get angry when you see my question. What do mean by "冤"? My understanding "冤" is innocent. If this is what you meant, then I really don`t see anyone suggested she was quilty. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {564} (#5399281@0)
This is why 1 thing I have been asking was the reason that CAS told the baby. I don`t think even CAS accused she abused her baby. My guess (I have no proof) is that CAS worker found her too emotion and afraid she might be out of control and danger her baby.

So far, I see no one said she was quilty in this forum. I know some of you don`t agree with me and they have good reason don`t agree with me, but I really think she had depression. This is all, she was not quilty at all.

The point I don`t agree is if CAS was quilty in anyway to handle this case.

"冤" means she had been treated badly and she was not deserved to be treated that bad. -fairness(直言执言); 2009-7-7 (#5400317@0)

在这里，有些人就是乐见跑题。 -buug(Crouching Tiger); 2009-7-7 (#5400246@0)

"loveblue有精神病的假设，以及虐待孩子的猜测，都已推翻" - 请你出示证据这些“猜测”都已推翻。。。 -guanshui88(约定); 2009-7-7 (#5399528@0)

如果仅仅是为了制造热点或者单纯造谣达到攻击他人目的，是非常非常缺乏道德。。。 -guanshui88(约定); 2009-7-7 (#5399540@0)

cas列出的条件就是要你承认它抓人放人都没有错，用孩子逼你就范。 -buug(Crouching Tiger); 2009-7-7 (#5400392@0)

@BC

Of course, I would not accept it. No one on Rolia suggested that! I would use all possible legal ways that are permitted in Canada to defend myself and my family. No reasonable parents would do nothing and just sit tight.

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