It is a difficult question to answer. I really don't know if I have ignored the cultutal difference. Bbut I am trying my best to answer your questions. -hkchan(0) @BC省华人论坛:BC省枫下论坛 The Rolia Forum of BC

枫下茶话 / 社会 / Does Rolia allow a Rolian to insult another Rolian? 良心被狗吃了, 绑匪. What else is allowed to insult another Rolian? Is this a civilized discussion? Is this how Chinese discuss? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399494@0)

You should have learned from the lesson I had years before. Just forget those idiot attacks and focus what you feel fun with. Your life should be decent, and you should always be a gentleman. -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-7-7 (#5399520@0)

Thanks for your sincere suggestion and I guess I would eventually learn your lesson. However, I just feel if this how we (Chinese) discuss, then I wonder if anyone would respect our discussion. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {82} (#5399533@0)
It may be time I leave this forum and go back to yours. Any fun with your system?

I haven't touched it for weeks. Just too busy to do it...and if there is no fresh and exciting idea, I would like to let it be idle...maybe we can have a cup of coffee somewhere at lunch time...:-) -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-7-7 (#5399548@0)

Do you mind to PM your site and see if I can inject some fresh idea to it? My children are on vacation and their summer programs are on strike, so I have to take care them and don't have time for lucnh until the strike is over!!! -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399564@0)

It is blocked here, and I won't try it anymore. -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-7-7 (#5399572@0)

hmm, 沉默的永远是大多数. 别有事没事的就把中国人扯进来. -buma(。。。。); 2009-7-7 (#5399527@0)

you got a good point. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399571@0)

这算啥，就这破事我还收到过死亡威胁PM：你必须被斩首示众! 。。。。反正这是个病态的社会。 -wjn(冬天的芹菜); 2009-7-7 (#5399545@0)

不是斩脚啊，还以为会变回菠菜呢。 -kingsw(Steven); 2009-7-7 (#5399550@0)

斩脚也不行，估计得五马分尸才能成菠菜。。。名人有那么好当吗？ -wjn(冬天的芹菜); 2009-7-7 (#5399561@0)
唉，不知道怎么说你～～菠菜的头，那是菜头，不是脚呀～～ -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399566@0)

win vs wjn -kingsw(Steven); 2009-7-7 (#5399585@0)

你这样说的话，那不是剁脚，那叫”去势“，哈哈 -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399597@0)
just joing! but the only difference that I can find is "i" is straight and "j" is bent. Do you try to imply something? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399606@0)

研究ing -kingsw(Steven); 2009-7-7 (#5399614@0)
if you cut the bottom of "j", then you get a "i". In china, we call some special officers closely working for the emperor, tai jian~~and there is a very important operation~~to make sure they don't~~ -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399632@0)

I still remember there were tons of anonymous calls to my cell phone, and then those famous IDs posted msgs saying I didn't pick up their calls. I sent numerous PMs trying to find someone talk face to face, no one likes to do it. -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-7-7 {5} (#5399559@0)
Sick.

牛哥，你把网络当现实了，看医生去。 -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399579@0)
估计都被你肚子上的九块吓坏了。就嘴上发发狠吧。 -wjn(冬天的芹菜); 2009-7-7 (#5399590@0)

OK, then I am the lucky one! -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399568@0)

I don't understand why you are interested in CAS topic? Come back to work and profession forum.:-) -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-7-7 (#5399580@0)

冷～～对死了个人的大事，不感兴趣～～唉～～ -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399586@0)

Seriously, I definitely discussed it with friends in a closed face to face environment. -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-7-7 (#5399611@0)

估计牛哥圈子里的朋友都是一致认定CAS没错，死的是精神病。不过我圈子里的南亚朋友们，比我还销克。 -oldyou(CAS是狼外婆吗); 2009-7-7 (#5399620@0)

结论取决于信息的摄入，在公开信息不明了的情况下，取决于旁人的描述。 -copperbean(豆泡果之铜豌豆); 2009-7-7 (#5399652@0)
一看就知道，层次不同。牛哥就没低于CEO级的南亚朋友。油哥估计也没有多少拿得出手的白兄弟。 -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399655@0)

当我觉得我的看法很可能会伤别人的心,我就不说了. -nicetomeetyou(蓦然回首彩虹跨天地); 2009-7-7 (#5399671@0)

结果你的话一点没少～～ -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399819@0)

估计油哥去了葬礼看到那个家庭，心里内疚，可能油哥发了让她精神崩溃的贴，也可能那个老公非常内疚，所以油哥那么坚持要让CAS背黑锅，可以自己或者让那个老公解脱 -may11(May); 2009-7-7 (#5400082@0)

cas就是个诱发事件，没有讨论价值，比如说我开车经过路口，看见一老人家红灯过马路不走行人线慢慢腾腾，我不nice, 按了两下喇叭，老人家受惊，心脏病复发，栽倒，头触地，引发脑血栓，送医院不治身亡，家属想告我，你说在这里有门么。 -buma(。。。。); 2009-7-7 (#5399631@0)

You may have a vaid point that CAS's involvement might actually trigger her mental problem. However, can I use your story to futher illustrate my argument since your story is very good. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 {1150} (#5399723@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛I only want to modify 1 small part of your story. What if you 按了两下喇叭 not becuase you were not nice but becuase you saw the old men's grand son tried to cross the road from the other side to meet his grandpa. A very fast car is running toward him with no sign to stop. You just tried to alert the boy and saved his life. You wanted to be a good Sebastian to save a life. Unfortunately, the result is that you saved a boy but accidently killed his grandfather. I am not a lawyer nor a a judge but what would be your verdict?

The difference is if you don't 按了两下喇叭, no one can sue you. But if a CAS worker sees a baby who may be in danger but didn't take the baby away then he is negligence (or even criminal negligence ) if the baby is hurt and killed in future.

If you argee with my story, then the only question is if the baby is in danger or the victm was so emotion that the CAS worker had reasonable belieft that the baby was in danger. What would you do if you were the CAS worker.

Unfortunarely, no one can give you any more information than those people who were present; e.g. people in the clinic, CAS worker.更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

You felt insulted when someone dumped 良心被狗吃了, 绑匪 on you. What did the lady feel when CAS worker took her child away? -whynot108(s2w); 2009-7-7 {188} (#5399779@0)
My question is how well the CAS work communicate with the lady, or just upset her by taking her child away and left her in panic without knowing her rights. Be human first, then be right.

Do you know the answer to your question? I don't and this is why I don't accuse CAS. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399805@0)

It's fact. The lady went from unstable condition to extremely unstable condition and at the end she committed suicide to herself. -whynot108(s2w); 2009-7-8 {193} (#5401131@0)
I think it is legitimate to request CAS to review their practice in this specific case and see whether it is necessary to improve their protocols. Just similar as you did to start this thread.

I totally agree that CAS should review this specific case and see if they can improve their process. Afterall, a mother was died. This is why I asked for a public inquiry at the right beginning, but I need support. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-8 {261} (#5401133@0)
The unfortunate part is some Rolians prefer to keep on accusing CAS rather than doing something constructive.

I don't see CAS had any wrong doing until someone can prove that CAS worker seized the baby when the baby was not in any danger. Can you prove it?

I may be wrong on this. When you kept asking for proof of CAS worker's wrongdoing in this case, you seemed to ignore the cultural differences. -whynot108(s2w); 2009-7-8 {610} (#5401163@0)
I only speak for myself. I grew up in Beijing, China and has strong Chinese background. My first reaction to this story was CAS should not take a child away from a Chinese mother without carefully evaluating the whole situation. It was brutal to a Chinese mother. In my impression, the Chinese culture trusts motherhood. No mother will intentionally do bad things to their kids. It is also my impression too. Taking a kid away from a Chinese mother will normally do more damage on the mother than the potential risk on her kids. I hope CAS could be aware this cultural difference and investigate in it.

It is a difficult question to answer. I really don't know if I have ignored the cultutal difference. Bbut I am trying my best to answer your questions. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-8 {3598} (#5401480@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛I came from HK and I am a father (not a mother) but I don't think father loves their children anything less than the mother. And I don't think parents with other cultures love their children anyth less than Chinese. Not normal parent would intentionally (sexual, physical or emotion) abuse their children. And I believe loveblue also loved her children a lot, I have no doubt on it.

However, I hope you can agree that there are rare situations that some parents are out of control, they are not longer themselves, e.g. a Taiwan woman killed her 4 months old baby just last week. And if you have some spare time, you can google on the web and find more examples. And CAS may be able to save children's life if their worker has the authority to seize ther children when the children are in danger.

If you don't agree with what I said above, you can stop here! I am sorry that I wasted your time. However, if you agree when any child is in danger, the CAS worker should be given the autority to seize the children (regardless their culture), then I think we should ask a very obvious question.

Was the baby in danger when CAS worker seized the baby from victim? I really don't know. I hope you can understand that I am not cold blood nor 良心被狗吃了 and you should know well that CAS won't pay me 5 cents for every post I put on this fourm. When I said I didn't know, I really mean it. And I have been asking for evidence all these time.

So why did I keep asking for proof? You must think I have too much time or I really enjoy creating chaos on this forum.

We live in Canada and we need evidence to accus any organization or any person. Using the Polish immigrant Robert Dziekanski as an example; do you think there would be any public inquiry if there was no video captured his death scene. This is one of the reasons that I keep asking questions.

The other one is if someone else read those myth, rumor incompleted facts about CAS and they believe CAS is an evil organization. And they don't turn to CAS even if CAS is their last resource. So another life may be lost just becuase the victim believes CAS is an evil organization; can you sleep well if you know you can do something to avoid it.

I hope you can spend sometime to go back and read all the accuse on CAS and try to verify some of them. See how many of them are true and valid.

Do you think other Rolians (apart from Rollor and Curiser99) make any progress so far by accusing CAS on this forum? Again, I don't know.

I never said CAS was not responsible and this is why initially I tried to raise a public inquiry. But I don't want to do it without consent from the victim's family. I have asked Rolians to pass my request to her husband but so far, I hear nothing.

Even if (a very big if) CAS has no wrong doing in this particular incident; is there anything that CAS, our government or even our community can do to avoid similar disaster in future? But how can we bring this incident / question to public attention without the consent of the victim's family?

If there is a small thing that we can for the family, it is to respect their wish. If they want to be in peace without further disturb from media, then should we still request the public inquiry. I don't think so, and this is why I stop. But if you think we should go ahead, then it is your choice.

I hope I answer your question. I didn't consider the culture difference becuase I think it doesn't matter. What mother (or father) would like CAS to take away their own children, Chinese or not!更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

I just feel very sorry about the family and I hope I would never see such disaster again. And I think they are going down the wrong direction (accusing CAS) rather than mental health awareness. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399618@0)

台湾人议会基本靠打，大陆人说事基本靠骂, dont you know that? sigh... too simple, sometimes.. sigh..... -win(秋天的菠菜); 2009-7-7 (#5399577@0)

Unfortunately, I am from HK. We don't 打 and 骂, most of time, we care about $$$$. I don't know why I am so invovled here. It is time to go home (work and profession forum). -hkchan(0); 2009-7-7 (#5399613@0)

HK people are included in 大陆人 since 1997, period. -win(秋天的菠菜); 2009-7-7 (#5399638@0)

甭客气，以牙还牙。 -mikesmith(老猫); 2009-7-7 (#5399646@0)

你这样，算什么？就好像80年代，美国对中国要求，取消关税，公平贸易～～很公平么？HKCHAN是受过教育的人，中文也不利落，怎么跟油哥对抗？你借副假牙给他？ -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399668@0)

你到底想insult HKCHAN呢还是想insult 老油呢？没看懂。。。 -whynot108(s2w); 2009-7-7 (#5399687@0)

甭客气, 一块儿收拾了。 -wjn(冬天的芹菜); 2009-7-7 (#5399693@0)

哈哈，是你说的，我没说～ -ignoreme(别当真); 2009-7-7 (#5399815@0)

陈老大这个根本就不算骂人，他们对你很客气，还没有问候你妈妈，你老婆，你妹妹 -may11(May); 2009-7-7 (#5400058@0)
你有时间查查你的那个哥们May11的帖子，看他是怎么回帖的，多少人被他骂过精神病之类的。没记错的话，是他开始出言不逊、不尊重他人的。要不你先劝劝他别再到处骂人啦，我这里先谢谢你啦。 -goldensands(Dream); 2009-7-7 (#5400078@0)

怎么啦，提个醒让你去看医生有什么问题吗，提醒你们不要忘记吃药是骂你吗，精神病是骂人吗，提醒你有精神病的症状让你去看医生，你应该感谢我才对 -may11(May); 2009-7-7 (#5400156@0)

如果您认为称呼他人精神病不是骂人，那我以后就昵称您精神病，没问题吧？ -goldensands(Dream); 2009-7-7 (#5400424@0)

你还在这里跟他们纠缠呢。。。算了吧。。。该明白的早明白了，不理解的也不会理解，喜欢折腾的说这些只能让他折腾得更欢。。。。至于实质性的进展，到现在一个没有。。。。 -kqc(海市); 2009-7-7 {64} (#5400295@0)
很佩服你的坚持，不过只要没人管，劣币逐良币基本是趋势。。。认了吧

我也挺佩服这个香港人的。我早就放弃了和他们辩论了，都是成年人，几乎不可能说服对方，所以最好的办法是learen from a lesson。 -volley(悠悠); 2009-7-7 (#5400372@0)

@BC

It is a difficult question to answer. I really don't know if I have ignored the cultutal difference. Bbut I am trying my best to answer your questions.

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