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@BC

There are 1.3 billion Chinese, let's say only 10% are children. We have 130 million children, how many children did you 看见儿童没有真正受到劣待? Is there any survey on children abuse in China to support your argument?

BTW what is 真正劣待? cutting their hands off?

Its report indicates that, among adult Canadians, 53 percent of women and 31 percent of men were sexually abused when they were children. Is this a good reason to have CAS in Canada to protect our children? 1 in 2 women had been sexual abused, do you have any daugther?
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Replies, comments and Discussions:

  • 枫下茶话 / 社会 / 一件这么简单的事情,搞得这么复杂.CAS作为一个专业机构,使用税款的机构.有存在的意义吗?一个机构的存在,应该使大多数人感到合适和有用的,可是,CAS有这个作用吗?我觉得中国政府机构都比它要人性化多了.
    • CAS需要改变.而这改变,不应该由它自己进行.
      • CAS's power is from our legislation, how do you suggest our legislator change the law?
    • 一个读了几年所谓SOCIAL WORKER,就可以剥夺别人最大的利益不受监督吗?他/她有多少社会经历啊?很多现代人,没有40岁左右,我觉得还没有真正成熟.有些,一辈子都成熟不了的.谁可以为别人做主啊?
      • 事情总是要人做的,你这种质疑可以算放之四海而皆准,想想移民官、警察、法官、律师、医生。。。。
        • 你的说法没有基本的逻辑.按照你的说法,北朝鲜政府是非常好的政府.
          • 我说你“放之四海而皆准”还错了?那你想要什么样的评价?
            • 我不需要你的评价.
              你不配.
              • 那就别在这种谁都能回的地方上帖。
                • 你害怕啦?
                  我对你的无知充满着悲哀.
                  • 我赚大发了。谢谢!
                    • 有人在此飙车,却不让人参与,看来是楼主睡眠不足.
                      • +1
      • 这就是观念的问题。如果你仅仅把孩子看成是自己最大的利益,也就是说,孩子是完全属于自己的,那CAS把孩子带走的确是不对的,但如果你把抚养孩子看成是自己最大的责任,孩子不仅仅属于自己,也属于社会,当一个人无法胜任抚养孩子的重任时,社会就应该参与对孩子的抚养,
        CAS正是由此而产生的
        • +1
        • This is the exact same reason that some parents killed their own children before they committed suicide. They believed their children were their own properties and they could do whatever they wanted for their children.
        • 当社会要强行介入一个家庭时,代价非常大。这不只是一个观念问题。它涉及到孩子的切身利益。谁也不能否认孩子与父母之间不可替代的亲情和血缘关系。谁也不能否认作为社会的基本元素,家庭的稳定与完整对孩子的重要性。
          一个人无法胜任抚养孩子的重任的标准是什末呢?如何保证不会被滥用,或者被不负责任地使用呢?cas再loveblue一事中的行为受到这里许多人的谴责,用孩子的社会性来解释恐怕不够。
          • What if there is no 亲情 but only abuse or the parents cannot control themselve and take care the kids. Did you read the news about a Taiwan woman who killed her own 4 months old baby? Should we allow CAS to protect children in extreme condition?
            But you have a very good question about how CAS decide if a child should be taken from his family. And make sure it is not 滥用. Do you mind to find out the answer and share with us?
      • CAS worker has to seek court order to take away a kid and only in emergency and with permission with their management, then CAS worker can seize a child without a court order. But they still need to seek court order within 5 days.
        Then you can argue if the judge has the authority to make such decision and yes, they have the authority. Our legislation granted them the authority. If you don't like the current arrangement and would like to change it, then you should talk to your MPP.
    • CAS讲座说会给我们英文合同看看,我还在等着.
    • 跟工会一样遗留下来的垃圾,迟早会被铲除的,时候未到而已。
    • 社会阅历和同情心不是考读书读出来的.CAS工作人员同时做了法官和警察的工作.这是不是独裁?是不是黑暗的社会?
      • How did a CAS worker do both 法官和警察的工作? CAS workers also need court order just like police officer.
    • 又一个有病了....
      • 向你这种人身攻击的说法...
      • +1
    • 中国有儿童保护组织吗?我从未听说过。我觉得应该成立一个,儿童教育的不好或者受虐待长大了作奸犯科还是要社会来承担。
      • 中国有妇联,以教育,帮助为主要工作方式。遇到违法行为,有警察
        • 中国妇联 is like 人大政协 ... 橡皮图章
          • 在中国父母管教儿女是家事没有人管的,很多时候管教和虐待只有一线之隔,旁人觉得不妥了打电话给警察,警察也不会管,只有死了或者出了其他严重后果警察才会介入。中国如果有专门儿童保护组织,很多被父母打死的儿童本来不会死的。
    • 简单吗? 恐怕不。从政府宏观角度来看,方针是用有限的资源,作最多的事,遭最少的抱怨。现状是最可行的方法之一。当然可以试试剥夺 CAS 部分权限。this maybe work, maybe not.
      记得这里一位CAS工作人员谈到历史上CAS曾经权限受到削弱,但造成孩子受害案件增加。大家应该合力来寻找这个最佳的“权限度”在哪里。我觉得大家可以 petition 修改《孩子及家庭法〉,试试减小CAS全县,看效果如何。
      • What you suggested is definitely not 简单. We have to fully understand CAS policies and procedures before we can make any recommendation. It would be a huge task.
        • surely it is not something 简单. I just saw so many people are mad at CAS,it is possible that the law should be modified to restrain CAS a bit, presently....
      • But if someone is willing to spend the effort, it would be a great task as well.
      • 在中国,没有CAS,也没有看见多少儿童真正受到劣待.以前中国这么穷.现在富一点了,中国儿童不劣待父母就不错了.难道加拿大的人的素质比中国人还差?如果你认为很多中国父母劣待儿童而导致他们成长问题,请给出统计数据.我看例子都不多.
        • 不要再在这里大放厥词了!不足可以揭露,缺点当然可以批评,但你目前需要的是谦虚、踏实的弄清这个制度的来龙去脉,而不是在这里唱些高调,用煽情代替理智。
        • There are 1.3 billion Chinese, let's say only 10% are children. We have 130 million children, how many children did you 看见儿童没有真正受到劣待? Is there any survey on children abuse in China to support your argument?
          BTW what is 真正劣待? cutting their hands off?

          Its report indicates that, among adult Canadians, 53 percent of women and 31 percent of men were sexually abused when they were children. Is this a good reason to have CAS in Canada to protect our children? 1 in 2 women had been sexual abused, do you have any daugther?
        • 新闻里小孩被打死的每年都有几起,被打死之前从来没有人和机构来管的。我小时候有个邻居头胎一个女孩因为条件限制送到亲戚家养了大半年然后接回来,后来又生了一男一女,都是亲生的,不知道为什么他们家老打这老大,也不让她上学,一天学都没上过,真是可怜,哪里有人来管。
        • 建议你到新浪关注虐待儿童问题专栏里看看,父母打小孩不打死打残是没有人管的。
          本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛追踪报道:北京五岁女童被虐杀真相
          http://www.sina.com.cn 2000年07月06日14:17 和讯homeway

            6月27日,5岁女孩于静遭父母殴打致死,但亲生父母为何对女儿如此狠心?至今仍是不解之谜。近日,《北京青年报》记者再次采访了有关当事人。

            天坛医院急诊室医生:6月27日晚10时多,一位30多岁的女人抱着一个孩子来到急诊室。当时孩子已深度昏迷,多处有皮下出血,经后来检查,致死原因为小肠破裂引发腹膜炎。在抢救过程中我们问孩子受伤原因,抱孩子来的女人说:“是她爸爸打的。”

            女童死亡后,按规定我们马上通知了派出所,公安人员将她和随后到来的孩子父亲隔离审查。爷爷奶奶不知儿媳名字

            死亡的小女孩叫于静。她的爷爷说:“6月28日早上6时,小陈(陈普珍)打来电话说你儿子把你孙女打死了,快来吧。

            记者在采访中发现,于静的爷爷奶奶只知道儿媳妇姓陈,陈普珍的名字还是从记者口中知道的。

            6月30日下午,于静的爷爷奶奶来到于静生活了不到4个月的小院时,于静的母亲陈普珍不在,接待他们的是邻居们。

            于静的奶奶气愤地说:“孩子没到半岁就不再尿床了,大些了又极爱干净,学前班老师夸她机灵,唱歌、跳舞、背诗、写字什么都会。我不理解儿子、儿媳为何要打她。”母亲称孩子手淫特别严重

            7月2日晚10时记者才找到位于北京丰台区南窑村陈普珍住的院子。陈普珍租住的屋里亮着灯,但没有人。街坊把记者带到了房东家。

            据房东讲,于则信、陈普珍夫妇在这里住了还不到1年,于则信在一家外企家具厂做销售工作,每月至少有1000元,陈普珍则一直没有工作。于则信为人内向,不爱说话,每天早晨6时多就上班了,下午6时多才回来,很少和街坊四邻交往。

            “孩子是今年春节时接来的,留两个小辫,又白又胖,这不才4个多月人就没了。”房东说,“孩子接过来三四天之后,陈普珍就开始打她,有一次我实在瞧不过去了,跑过去给了她肩上两拳。我说,孩子有天大的错,也不能抽她大嘴巴。”

            陈普珍曾辩解说,打孩子是因为她在屋里大小便。正在房东家看电视的邻居金先生对记者说:“那是打的。我和他们家住斜对面,每天他丈夫一出家门,她就开始打孩子,一天比一天打得厉害,估计于则信差不多回来了,才不打了。这时孩子算是解放了。陈普珍打孩子可太狠了。”

            房东也直摇头说:“刚开始于则信还没怎么打孩子,也就这一两个月,他也动手打起来。开始时孩子还哭,后来就听不见哭声了,那肯定是不让哭。小孩眼光都是直的,那种天真劲儿一点都没有了。”父亲上班后母亲猛打孩子

            记者在房东家一直采访到10时55分,出去看了两次,陈普珍仍然没有回来。

            出了小院,有一条约500米没有路灯的夹道。记者正走着,对面一个黑影飘过来,近了才看出是一个骑车人,借着一点天光,隐约看出,这人留一个寸头,和记者擦身而过时,她又回过头看了记者一眼。

            凭直觉,记者感到这人就是陈普珍。

            记者转身跟上,果然留寸头的女人正在那所小院门前敲门,一问,她正是陈普珍。

            陈普珍在租住的房前加盖了一个三四平方米的小厨房。正屋房间的左侧靠墙放着一排柜子,上面摆着一台63厘米彩电和一套音响,地上铺着一块化纤地毯,屋里没有凳子,只有一个小矮圆凳,四五岁小孩坐正合适,也许是小于静生前常坐的。记者观察了一遍屋里,没有发现一件小孩的玩具,只在墙根处发现了一双小孩的凉鞋。陈普珍坐在床上,记者开始了采访。

            记者:“小孩生下来不久,就送到爷爷奶奶那边去了,当时情况是怎么样的?”

            陈普珍:“我生她时,我丈夫正开出租车,觉得小孩晚上吵,休息不好,于是送到爷爷奶奶家去了。当时我也不愿意,临走时,我直哭。”

            说着陈普珍从一个手提包里拿出5张照片,有孩子自己的,有孩子与父亲和爷爷奶奶一起的,有两张是孩子和母亲的。惟独没有孩子和父母一家3口的照片,也没有一家5口的合影

            更让记者感到惊异的是照片上那个搂着孩子的陈普珍面色白皙,目光中透着一种平和慈祥;而眼前的陈普珍,大约由于刚剃了头,黑瘦,浑身上下像是拧着劲。陈普珍说这是为“进去”(进拘留所)而专门剃的头,还把裙子也绞了。说这话时,她一脸平静。

            陈普珍说:“现在大家都说是我打的孩子,我是打过,但孩子最后是他父亲打死的。他们(指孩子的爷爷和奶奶)请了律师要为孙女讨回公道,实际上是要为儿子讨回公道。你们失去了儿子,我还失去了女儿呢。我生她时,没有羊水,是大夫让我丈夫按着肚子生挤出来的,当时生她没少受罪。毕竟是我亲生骨肉。”

            记者:“你和丈夫的关系怎样?”

            陈普珍沉默了良久才回答:“他有心理障碍,觉得我是外地人,他们家也不同意我们结婚。我丈夫一直不喜欢女孩。”

            记者:“你喜欢女孩吗?”

            陈普珍没有说话。

            记者:“那你为什么要打孩子呢?”

            陈普珍:“她手淫,特别严重,而且她不让我搂着睡,她喜欢让她爸爸搂着睡。”

            记者:“当天,你怎么意识到要带孩子去医院的?”

            陈普珍:“打完了,我给孩子洗了个澡,凉快凉快,发现她出虚汗,肚子痛,叫妈妈,妈妈……”

            记者:“大家都很关注这事,你还有话要说吗?”   陈普珍沉默不语。摘自《北京青年报》更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
    • You bring up a good question. Are most Canadian feel CAS is adequate and useful? If Canadians do not feel this way, why do they give CAS more and more power over the last 10 years. If you studied family law, you would find
      family law had granted more power to CAS in the last 10 years? Why? They were not happy with CAS; so they decided to give CAS more power?
      • There are no perfect country in this world. Canada made mistakes in history. Is this another mistake? Law is not always the intention of most people.
        • I totally agree! I know lawyers from HK, England and Canada. They often told me how our legal system was abused and it is very expensive. But until we have a better syste, what else we can do? At least, it provides a second eye to control CAS.
      • It's not true. Actually, family law had limited CAS's power since part of CAS scandles 曝光 in the end of 2006. CASs have got fewer kids in last two and a half years.
      • That's why they did some apprehensions illegaly because they would not get kids if they did that legaly. I will share the law information with all of you when I have time.
      • The goverment is going to do more to limit their power soon.
      • They never tell people their limits but only tell people they have unlimited power to fool people. They have been benefiting by their cheating, deceiving and trapping. Immigrants did not know law well so that were fooled and hurt by them.
      • If loveblue knew law, she would ask that CAS worker to get a court order first (only takes one or two hours).
        • I believe you know a lot about CAS. Do you think it is a good idea to setup a Chinese web site to tell Chinese commmunity how to handle CAS encounter. I also believe you should have no difficulty to find volunteer.
          Or even just setup a Rolia forum and you can be the owner of it. I didn't know much about the sacndles in 2006. What was it? The only one I know was the poor girl who died in her forster family (I believed it was her grand parents as well). I was very mad and sent a lot of email out and even to my Church. But I didn't know there was any reform after the problem. Can you please share your information.
          • CASs were ordered to reform in Dec. 2006. Some new laws and regulations about child welfare were made between Jan. 2007 to March 2007. A three yrs old foster boy was killed by a teenager foster girl in a foster family.
          • Some foster children were beaten to die or ignored to die in foster family. In the summer of 2007, a 1 year old Toronto foster boy drown in the pool of his foster family and died.
          • Also in 2007, a 63 yrs old Toronto foster father was arrested and charged for raping foster child(ren).
            • that was similar to the disaster that I know. CAS may save the children from their own family where they had been abused; but CAS cannot put them into another hell. That was my objection to CAS couple years ago.
              • The girl(maybe two girls) was/were unrelated to that guy(only foster relationship). That guy had been a foster for over ten years so that police were calling if there were more victims. This matter then went silence like other matters that related CAS.
          • They put quite a few unrelated foster children in one foster family and younger ones are bollyed badly by older ones. CAS only ask fosters to offer a bed so that foster kids have to share bedroom with other unrelated ones.
          • Foster kids were taken by CAS(some of them were illegally taken) then were forced to live in such bad situations. Some teenager foster children run away but CAS called police to find them and sent them back to CAS.
            • Thank you for sharing all these info with us but those are after the children were put into a foster home. Any suggestion on what we should do if I see a CAS worket standing right outside of my door NOW!
      • That CAS worker would not get a court order because baby's dad is living home. The baby would not be sent to foster home and loveblue would not suffer so much to die.
        • I just wish loveblue learnt all your experience / knowledge before her encounter with CAS. How unfortunate?