If the avage hourly rate for the total compensation (including all benefit) is $40 per employee works for Toronto City. Anf if private companies are willing to do it for $20 / hr, then the saving can be used to hire more people to provide extra services,

hkchan(0)

day care for low (no) income family.

"你以为你要找工人就一定有呀？" With unemployment rate approached double digits, how many Rolians would think it is difficult to to find extra employee? And how many people who do not have a job would say "No" to a job with $20 / hr.

And when Toronto City choose what private companies to provide services for Toronoto, we can always put into contract that they must hire Canadian residents to do the jobs. Very simple!

Did I ever say "私营化你以为是万能的", I just said private sector can provide tthe same services for lower cost and we can use the saving to provide more annd better services to Toronto residents.

Apart from Toronto City union workers, how many Rolians (or Toronto residents) would be against the idea to have more and better services for the same budget?

(#5412291@0)
Last Updated: 2009-7-12
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Very stupid idea. There are many cases before that proven privatized service eventually cost more. -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5411550@0)

没有一个主意在被实践之前就可以定义是愚蠢的，哪怕经过证实，它真的是愚蠢的。 -kingsw(Steven); 2009-7-12 (#5411552@0)

what you said sound really stupid. Many things you don't have to try, you would know that is stupid. -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5411560@0)

你没试过，不等于人家没有试过。人类有那么长的历史，试点东西，不算难事。上面的提案，其他几个加拿大的城市有试过，不过那是题外话。 -kingsw(Steven); 2009-7-12 (#5411563@0)

上吊会死人，要试吗？外包的工作，私人公司一样可以绑架市民要求利益更大化，最后还不是市民买单？还不如自己养工人，用着顺手。 -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5411573@0)

语无伦次之前，要想清楚，发出来的帖子是收不回去的。不跟了。 -kingsw(Steven); 2009-7-12 (#5411578@0)

你无知就无知啦，欧洲北美外包和私营化失败的例子不计其数，你以为你小脑袋很聪明吗？人家早就知道了，不是好办法人家才不全面实施的，非工会的垃圾工多伦多有不是没有，你要是可市议员谈谈就知道了，不是一个好办法。 -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5411587@0)

私人公司多得很，感觉不好就换一家。Holyday主政下的Etobicoke将收垃圾工作外包就被证明是成功的。 -lionel(Lionel); 2009-7-12 (#5411800@0)

做人不能只讲钱，还要讲良心。很多男人还想把老婆的工作外包呢，竞争上岗怎么样？至于是不是证明是成功的，要看用什么标准。不能一厢情愿。 -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412155@0)

Did Toronto Union workers 讲良心 for us? And how does outsource Toronto City services has anything to do with 良心? Lower unemployment rate and more services is not 讲良心 for most Toronto residents? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412234@0)

如果你这么不喜欢加拿大，如果你认为只有铁腕资本主义才是真在的良心，你完全可以回去香港享受绝对的资本主义，享受一下香港垃圾工人住的笼屋，享受一下香港新移民的苦难。别忘了，香港都在搞最低工资，在搞综援。 -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412275@0)

I love Canada! And when did say "只有铁腕资本主义才是真在的良心"; do you mean private companies = 铁腕资本主义? Did you want to say private companies do not have 良心? What is wrong with private compaines? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412307@0)

你那种指责罢工工人的pointing figure的做法没有任何实际意义。而你希望让大量工人降低生活水平来维持你生活水平的做法就是没有良心。 -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412333@0)

How did I point finger to 罢工工人? I just suggested to outsource to private company so that our City can save money to provide us more and better services. And I hope City can hire more people with the extra saving is 没有良心? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 {146} (#5412344@0)
You better talk to those who are currently unemployed to see if my idea is 没有良心 for them. You would be very surprised to find out the answer.

what about the workers working on these post right now? fire them and let their family suffer, is that 有良心？ -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412354@0)

they can still keep their job if they want to accept the reduced rate. It is up to them. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412357@0)

Did I say I didn't support 最低工资 and 综援? I just suggested to outsource city services. How did this suggestion become against 最低工资 and 综援? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412313@0)

CUPE的人不配在这里讲“良心“。 -lionel(Lionel); 2009-7-12 (#5412573@0)

To be quite honest, why do emploer need to have “良心" for employee? If you can double your income for the same job in term of job security and nature, how many of us would be loyal to your boss? I won't! -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 {110} (#5412594@0)
I got laid off a few time and even got my rate cut by 60% once but I never said my boss didn't have “良心".

For those who think it is a good idea, please write to your councillor. I told him I want Toronot to outsource garbage collection for ever. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5411810@0)

外包给签证工人怎么样，让加拿大工人统统失业，然后国移们滚蛋回家，让加拿大只有主子和奴隶，让奴隶永远变不了主子，更好的办法就是恢复贩卖黑奴。请问楼上的，你活在哪个世纪？ -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412165@0)

Outsource to private companies = slave? I have been working for private companies all my life, I never feel I am a slave. BTW, most tax payers work for private companies, so those "slave" actually pay for the Toronto union workers' salary. -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 {227} (#5412229@0)
I suggested to outsource to private companies, so Toronto City can hire more people to provide more services. Lower unemployment rate plus more services! Why not? And how does 加拿大工人统统失业? I don't follow your logic!

I never say "Outsource to private companies = slave". I guess you can't never understand my point. Whatever, but don't accuse me for I didn't say. -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412236@0)

then why did you say "让加拿大只有主子和奴隶", I just suggested to outsource Toronto City services to private sector? So how do you jump from "outsource" to "让加拿大只有主子和奴隶"? Mind to share yur logic? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412248@0)

请看第一句，“外包给签证工人怎么样”，和外包给私营公司有可比性吧，肯定更便宜，更听话。那么引进奴工呢？比签证工人更好了，那就退回上上世纪了。 -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412266@0)

Did I suggest to 外包给签证工人? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412299@0)

No, but I did. Better than your idea, isn't it? -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412310@0)

why do you think your idea is better than mine? Your idea would not reduce unemployment rate but actually increase it, whereas mine would reduce unemployment rate. So how is yours better than mine in term of unemployment rate? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412320@0)

your assumption is wrong, don't you realize? how do you know outsource will lower unemployment rate? it is your assumption, and I can tell you it is wrong. it will only make it worse. -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412327@0)

Can you please show how my assumption is wrong. If the city has a budget of 3 billion to hire 30,000 workers and if their rate is cut to half, then the city would now have a saving of 1.5 billion, can city use the saving to hire more people? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 {87} (#5412337@0)
if more people are hired, the unemployment rate is lower. What's wrong with my logic?

Can you tell me how old are you? how can you ask such stupid questions? -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412345@0)

My age is personal info and I just asked you to show me how my assumption was wrong. Why did you say it was stupid? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412355@0)

假设加拿大多伦多适合做垃圾工人的人口是一个常数，私营化怎么能够增加就业？怎样改善多伦多市政面临的问题？你以为你要找工人就一定有呀？如果那样，为什么还要移民？还要季节性雇佣中南美洲的农业工人？私营化你以为是万能的吗？ -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412259@0)

If the avage hourly rate for the total compensation (including all benefit) is $40 per employee works for Toronto City. Anf if private companies are willing to do it for $20 / hr, then the saving can be used to hire more people to provide extra services, -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 {835} (#5412291@0)
day care for low (no) income family.

"你以为你要找工人就一定有呀？" With unemployment rate approached double digits, how many Rolians would think it is difficult to to find extra employee? And how many people who do not have a job would say "No" to a job with $20 / hr.

And when Toronto City choose what private companies to provide services for Toronoto, we can always put into contract that they must hire Canadian residents to do the jobs. Very simple!

Did I ever say "私营化你以为是万能的", I just said private sector can provide tthe same services for lower cost and we can use the saving to provide more annd better services to Toronto residents.

Apart from Toronto City union workers, how many Rolians (or Toronto residents) would be against the idea to have more and better services for the same budget?

天真，失业率高不代表适合从业于垃圾工人的人数就多。你有没有社会经验呀。我懒得跟你说了。幼稚得可以。 -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412322@0)

Goodbye! Did I say city should hire more people to collect garbage? I must be too 天真 to understand your argument on 失业率高不代表适合从业于垃圾工人的人数就多. What is the qualification for 垃圾工人? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412329@0)

你又一个假设错误。垃圾工人不是你想干就干的，也不是人人都愿意干的。 -2439(2439); 2009-7-12 (#5412341@0)

that was my question, can you please tell us the qualification of a 垃圾工人? I didn't say "人人都愿意干的" but there would be enough fro $20 / hr without any benefit? -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412349@0)
垃圾工人不是人人都愿意干，但是有足够多的人愿意为了$20/h而去干。 -lionel(Lionel); 2009-7-12 (#5412572@0)

假设政府征收的地税款不变，节约下来的钱可以开展新的工程：比如改善多伦多的道路，桥梁，提升多伦多的竞争力。开展这些新的工程就需要公用更多的工人，难道不能增加就业吗？ -lionel(Lionel); 2009-7-12 (#5412567@0)

I am a small man and can only think of adding day care services but you have much larger vision than me...... Well done! -hkchan(0); 2009-7-12 (#5412628@0)

@BC

If the avage hourly rate for the total compensation (including all benefit) is $40 per employee works for Toronto City. Anf if private companies are willing to do it for $20 / hr, then the saving can be used to hire more people to provide extra services,

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